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TENNIS.com - String Theory by Tom Perrotta- Grass Queen
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« You Asked, I Answer King Rafa »
Grass Queen
Posted 07/05/2008 @ 2 :02 PM

Venus "My first job is big sister," Venus Williams said today as she celebrated her fifth Wimbledon title (and held up the aptly named Venus Rosewater Plate).

Well, today big sister looked out for herself. Despite falling behind by a break of serve early in both sets, Venus played a clean match and took advantage of almost every opportunity Serena gave her while Serena squandered far too many chances. Venus' consistency and toughness were even more remarkable considering the wind that whipped through Centre Court all afternoon. The gusts were strong and unpredictable, sometimes blowing across the court, other times the length of it, other times swirling in circles. To my mind, the wind favored Serena's game: She's a more solid player (she's less prone to wild ground strokes) and has a much smoother and simpler service motion with a lower, steadier toss and a more consistent delivery (Venus has a "funky toss," Serena said). Venus, to her credit, remained patient and ignored the elements as best she could.

Venus and Serena had played six major finals before this match and Serena had won five of them, including their only two at Wimbledon. I came away from Serena's five victories with the same conclusion: Both sisters hate to lose, but Serena hates it more. She has always been the more willful player, the more relentlessly competitive player (I say this not to detract from Venus, but to emphasize Serena's unrivaled determination). After a loss, Serena is always sour (today's post-match press conference was no exception). Venus can't help but continue to smile. Serena fumes, Venus lets go.

These differences in personality have favored Serena in past meetings and I thought they would work to Serena's advantage today, too. But could they counteract the distinct advantage Venus has on grass? Venus' game is more explosive than Serena's. She has a harder serve, better volleys, more speed, more quickness, a longer reach, more agility, and maybe most important of all, more aptitude for creative shot making, like the winning backhand volley she hit in the third game of the match yesterday when little sister lined up a backhand and rocketed the ball toward her big sister's belly. When Venus has too much time to consider her options, she often tenses up and commits ghastly errors. When someone like her sister, or a grooved Lindsay Davenport (in the 2005 final) is drilling the ball at Venus on grass, however, she simply reacts, a does it better than anyone else in the game. Most players suffer when you take time away from them. Venus thrives.

I came to this match thinking over these two opposing forces--Serena's psychological advantage against Venus' superior grass court skills--and early on it looked like Serena would carry the day. She took command of the match from the start (superior strokes and superior attitude) and won the first two games while losing one point. When Venus served at 30-40 down 3-1, she was on the verge of losing not just the set, but her confidence. Her athleticism saved her. She brought the game to deuce with a stretch volley winner and hustled her way to a lucky let cord winner on the next point. Venus soon broke serve to square the set at 4-4. Suddenly, the sisters were playing the match Venus wanted to play: Lots of side-to-side rallies that left Serena winded, intermittent attacks on the net that favored Venus' volleys, and serving that relied on brute force more than placement. Venus served almost a third of her serves into Serena's body ("Body is my favorite here: You can't defend it," she said), a tactic that gave her a lot of short returns to punish. Serena continued to favor wide and down-the-middle serves and after a while, her long-limbed sister began returning them with more force. Serena needed seven break points to win the third game of the second set (she converted only 2 of 13 for the match). Venus needed just one break point to return the favor (she converted 4 of 7). A few games later, the Queen of grass put the match away.

A few words on the quality of this match, ever a subject of interest when the Williams sisters play. Under normal circumstances, I'd give this match an A- (thoroughly entertaining, but three sets would have been better). But the wind changes the grading scale here, so I'll give it an A+. The conditions, again, bordered on terrible. It's incredible that these two players were able to play so aggressively, and with so few errors, under these circumstances. They drilled ball after ball. They served with power and precision. They hit astonishing reflex volleys. It was the Williams sisters at their best and without a doubt my favorite of their many matches. It also must be said that the fix wasn't in--you knew that from the early going when Serena attempted that body blow. (Take that, Elena Dementieva!)

Before this tournament began, there was one thing Venus Williams had not achieved at Wimbledon: She hadn't beaten her sister--the best player of her era other than Venus--in the final. Now she has. She is, without doubt, the best grass court player of her generation. When the sisters finally do retire, Serena may be remembered as the better overall player. But Wimbledon will always belong to Venus.

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Comments

Tom,

Does this win places Venus ahead of Justine as this generation's second best player?

Serena being first, of course.

chiconinja,

yes.:).

I think Henin's better then Serena

I personally enjoy Henin's game much more than any other player. I'm not even a fan of the Williams sisters. However, you have to recognize Serena's been the most dominant player of her generation, even with all the time out she's taken from tennis.

I still place Justine as the second best of this era because her game is much more complete. Plus, she managed to win 7 slams in the Williams era, which says a lot about her game.

Venus is, to me, a close third place.

Just Horsen,

You may have a case for Justine being better than Serena, considering how she beat her on 3 straight slams last year.

However, Justine at her prime couldn't take the Serena that won 4 straight slams. During those times, there was nobody close to her. It was ridiculous how good she was.

PS. Justine is my favorite player.

I've always thought that the sisters were 1dimensional games but this match just proves it more.

Justice Henin is #1!!!!!!!!!

Is the mantle of who is better awarded based on preference of style, or superiority of record/game? Who was more dominant in this generation, Venus or Henin? To date, I would give Henin the edge only because she won 3/4 of the slams, as opposed to 2/4 for Venus. However, Venus is still playing, whereas Henin isn't. And then there's doubles as well. SO at the end of the day, I still think Venus will be ahead of Henin.

How can Justine be better, without winning Wimbledon, and having retired? I suspect that is an opinion of style, rather than factual basis of game. And the whole 3/4 beating thing has to be looked at as part of the whole story, not just as a 'most recent' case. Their overall head to head has to count more than what occurred in one year.

In the vernacular of my peoples: "Ain't nobody talking about Justine Henin!!!! This article is about Venus's WIN over her younger sister Serena and well-deserved it was!!!

Not one of the female players in this tournament has won Wimbledon five times. Think about how hard it is to win it ONE time - let alone five times.

GIVE VENUS HER PROPS!!!

Congratulations Venus. I knew you could do it and I knew you would.

Chiconinja

I can see where you're coming from and I will say Serena is extremely close to Henin but what really stood out about Henin was her courage something that Serena doesn't have. Henin was my favorite player hands down and the tours not the same without her. Anyway Congratulations Venus !!

OK OK OK!!! so and so is better than so and so. All I know is that Venus played a great match today against her sister. Wasn't sure she could muster it up. That win was for every big sister out there or should I say every underdog sister.

Justine had her run when Veuns and Serena where pretty much MIA due to illness / family tradgedy. Recent wins over the sisters came when they were making their comeback and playing part0time at best. NO way could henin handle Serena in her prime....and now that Venus and Serena are healthy again...her beating them today is in question. And courage? That event at the FO a few years back should tell you all you need to know about her character and courage.

they won doubles too. it just gets better and better.

I think,this is by far the most interesting game the sisters have played in a long time.Congratulations to Venus for a well deserved win

Mrs. Tennis, I am with you this post is about Venus Ebony Starr Williams. 5 time Wimbledon Champion. She who everyone wrote off (again) and who won Wimbledon singles and doubles without dropping a set. Take that everyone else on the WTA Tour. She played a fantastic match. She held her nerve and played lights out tennis against one of the best returners in the game. She made Serena look ordinary out there. One of my best points of the match was when she was down break point for the forthleventeenth time she served a second serve ace out wide that all Serena could do was squeal. Impressive performance. So glad that I was able to watch the match from beginning to end.

I'm with MrsSanta... This is about Venus!!! 2008 Singles and doubles Wimbledon champ! Yippppeeee!!!!!


OOOPs, sorry Mrs Tennis... Overexcitement (hides face)

its very nice to see againg that williams sister are in their best ,i hope that next will be usa open ,and they will dominant on womens tennis againg,serana and venus both are great players,nobody can compare whit them,even not henin,

Superb piece after what I thought was a superbly enjoyable match, Tom. Thank you for writing it.

this was a final to remember. as a true williams fan, i have always dreaded watching the sisters play against each other. but this time around, i was rooting for venus all the way. wimbledon is venus' because venus is the best grass player of her generation. well done venus! and good effort serena; maybe at the us open you will get your revenge.

Get one thing straight, Justine Henin has not been as impactful on tennis as either Williams nor has she been as impressive. For anyone who says her 7 is more glorious than Venus's is kidding themselves. Venus is 7 - 2 against henin (3-1 in grand slams). People seem to forget that Venus and Serena in their primes played in 5 of 6 grand slam finals. If there was no Serena, Venus would have at least 12 slams and have won on all surface. Justine Henin my @#$.

BOTH OF THE WILLIAM SISTERS PLAYED GREAT! Y IS IT EVERY TIME THEY WIN THERE IS ALWAYS SOME NEGATIVE COMMENT MADE ABOUT THEM? IF SHARAPOVA OR HENIN HAD OF WON U WOULD OF HEARD NOTHING BUT PRAISE AND HOW GREAT THEY ARE! BUT SINCE A WILLIAM SISTER WON ALL WE EVER HEAR IS NEGATIVITY! THE WILLIAM SISERS PLAYED A GREAT GAME TODAY AND I FEEL THAT THEY DESERVE THEIR PROPS. DUE TO THEM BEING BLACK AND WON ESPN2 AND OTHER SPORTS STATIONS ARE DOWN PLAYING IT AS IF THEY AINT NOTHING! BUT HAD IT BEEN SHARAPOVA OR HENIN WE WOULD BE HEARING ABOUT THIS UNTIL THE COWS COME HOME. SINCE THE WILLIAM SISTERS ARE BLACK THEY DONT GET THE SAME KIND OF PRAISE AS THEIR WHITE COUNTER PARTS WHICH AINT RIGHT BUT IT IS GOING TO CONTINUE TO HAPPEN! CONGRATULATIONS VENUS! YOU PLAYED A HECK OF A GAME. SERENA, YOU ALSO PLAYED A GREAT GAME! BOTH OF YOU LADIES KEEP IT UP. SOMEDAY THE MEDIA WILL GIVE BOTH OF YOU VERY TALENTED YOUNG LADIES THE SAME PRAISE AS THEY GIVE THE SHARAPOVA OR THE HENIN. BUT UNTIL THEN BOTH OF YALL KEEP YOUR HEADS UP! BOTH OF YALL DID WONDERFUL! CONGRATS AND MUCH PRAISE TO BOTH OF YALL!

I didn't see the match, but from this post there are alot of themes being echoed about Venus' game that have been said about Richard Gasquet. The instinctual nature of grass court tennis seems to give both shot makers an edge after their head is removed from the equation. I can only hope that he can repeat the same success that Venus has had at this tournament.

As for the current debate: I will admit that I am a complete Henin KAD and normally no fan of neither Venus nor Serena, but I would be hard pressed to call Henin the greatest player of her generation. If we were to compare the moments of each of the sister's dominance with Henin's 2007 season we would see that there are vast differences in their demeanor and games, but there are common levels of ability. If we were to look at the years that these players' powers were not at there height there would still not be much to separate them. I think we as fans have to settle Venus being the best on grass, Henin being the best on clay, and Serena being the best on the majority of the days that here head was screwed on right.

Fantastic match by both (especially Venus) and congratulations to them for winning the Singles and Doubles Championship! Fantastic job (now my weekend will be complete if Roger can hold up his end) *wink*...

I applaud the william sisters hanging in there despite the negative thing commetators would find to say of their commitment.

Henin, Henin, Henin, a good player she was and an even better cheater. Yes she beat Serena on the latter end of her career, but 2 of the win serena was injured. their last meeting befor henin's supposed retirement, Serena left Henin racket spinning.
She said health was not the reason for her retirement, and I certainly wish her well, that she is no physical ill. That being said, I hope she stays retire, because that I could respect her more. Why? She Cheated Serena at the French open, when she lied, and say she didn't hold up her hand! She cheated mauresmo.
since she was going to lose anyway, by quittig! the match, as if!
And now the tennis world, you start losing, you are fined! you are #1, but before that is contested you up and retire! Right,
I hope she stays out, for the sake of the tennis world. Why I respect her ability to play the game of tennis good, I detest her tactics of manipulating the sport.

Credit to venus and Serena for walking in a great deal of integrity, especially Venus, she is tuly a #1 true competitor.

I m a diehard Justine fan...still I would say Venus is the best on grass in this current generation of players and so the best player has won today.Venus absolutely deserves the Rosewater Dish.

Serena will end her career as the best player of this generation. The 2nd best has to go to Venus, not Justine. Justine is incredible but sorry, clay is not as well-regarded as grass in tennis history. Wimbledon is the most prestigious title in the world and Venus has 5.

No, Serena is a better player than Henin as far as her career is concerned. More slam titles in not just singles, but doubles and Serena led their head -to- head not to mention a 6-,6-2 beating in Miami by Serena back in March before her retirement.

If you consider Henin to be better than Serena, do you consider Seles to be better than Graf? After all, for a long time, Seles was defeating Graf in slam finals, and one could argue that had she not been stabbed, she would have ended up with many more slams, and thus robbed Graf of some of hers?
I don't think many people would argue Seles being better than Graf, simply because the record (and not the time they played) speaks for itself. Serena's record is way better than Henin's at the slams, and she will go down in history as more accomplished than her. Probably Venus too, for that matter.

Justine Henin has no Wimbledon finals wins. Serena has two and now Venus has 5. How in the world is Henin better than BOTH of them? She is a great player but she is to the Williams sisters what Rafael Nadal is to Roger Federer. (and that may be a generous overstatement) Those who don't see this are about as silly as those nutjobs who would support Hillary Clinton (who has 95% of the same policies as Barack Obama) and then make the leap to supporting John McCain. Hmmm, I wonder what is causing all the nonsense.

The Williams Sister's are awesome. My props to Venus for winning eventhough Serena's my favorite player. I don't Henin was anywhere near the player everyone makes her out to be. She was an opportunitisic cheater and many times choker. The girl has NO guts. And if she looked over at Carlos ONE MORE time - I was going to give up women's tennis. Henin retiring was one of the best thing to happen to Women's Tennis. Just think the way she retired ... just before the French Open ... she was SCARED of being crushed again either my the Williams, Sharapova or the up and coming Serbs. Go Serena Go Venus the TRUE CHAMPIONS of Women's Tennis.

Retiring early seems to be one of the most sage things Henin ever did, because it appears people remember her as a far better player in her absence than her presence. She is definitely one of the greats, but aren't we putting her a tad too high in remembrance of how early she left. This is a player who was only really dominant at the French. Sure, she won the other slams in convincing fashion, but she will never go down as one of the most dominant champions. Some people seem to put her in a category of player that made the most of what she had i.e. she wasn't the best of her generation, but maximized on every single opportunity she had.

Venus deserved this title. She has played some great tennis here. I agree with you Luke,because Wimbledon rather than Roland Garros is considered themost prestigious tennis tournament becauseofthe history of the All England Club and the background of the grass surface. Congratulations to both Serena and Venus.

Congratulations to Venus,I really thought she would win today, her
game is perfect for grass,she is a great athlete,her net play is outstandingand for her to win a 5th Wimbledon tittle at the age of 28 says it all!!!.

Congrats to Venus on her 5th Wimbledon singles title. And congrats to Venus and Serena on their doubles win.

Willowtree: I'm missing TW's Mrs. Santa! Where are you Mrs. S? :)

I'm known far and wide as a very tough and stingy grader, but I have to go along with Tom's A+ for this match. It was terrific. Congrats to Venus and Serena on an amazing day of tennis!

Have a good rest, Venus, and I'll see you in Philly for WTT. I was glad to hear her say that she has to play her WTT matches since my friend and I got our tickets and we can't wait to see her here.

Glad Venus took it. I have always like her, and her game much better than her sister. Go Venus!

Brandon
http://www.thefreshcan.com
Tennis Deals with a Splash of Personality

To all,
When the Williams Sisters decides to retire, people will respect their accomplishments more especially if the top players continue to produce inconsistent results.

Serena - 8 Slams with 2 Wimbledon
Venus - 7 Slams with 5 Wimbledon (3rd in Open Era behind Martina(9) and Steffi (7).
Williams Sisters - 7 Slam titles in doubles with 3 Wimbledons.

Guess what the main headline to 2009 Wimbledon for the WTA will be? Hint - Venus to attempt a three-peat. This has not been accomplished since Steffi Graf did it from 1991-1993.

May this be a lesson to all of you for tomorrow:

Winners on a certain surface will find a way to win on that surface. Venus showed this today, and I expect Roger will show this tomorrow (if the rain doesn't come).

Also, I have yet to here a negative bias towards the Williams. As a big fan of the sisters, I heard nothing but praise for the sisters today. Mary Carillo said today that the Williams were better than Henin, which I do agree with.

Congratulations Venus on your outstanding singles win and to you and Serena on your doubles win. What a talented two you both are.
It is really insulting to hear reporters ask questions of you both about a possible "fix". It just seems to me that whenever african american athletes accomplish greatness, people try to inject negativity in it. Maybe one day people will be judged on their accomplishments rather than some stereotypical nonsense.

Serena looked so disappointed at the loss...all the little baby sister emotions welled to the surface. She simply got outplayed. She'll undoubtedly use that frustration as motivation to win US Open. I predict another Williams final!!!

Even though Serena lost she will always be better than Venus. You could not compare Henin and Venus to Serena thats just dumb. I think Serena let Venus win because i know Serena could of smashed on her big sister.

http://thedeftvolleys.blogspot.com/

My thoughts on the match her.

Alex, don't be bitter here man.

Congratulations Venus (and Serena)!!!! You gave us tennis at it's best. And the Doubles title is sweet sweet icing on the top. Love you both!

As for Justine H., her lack of character turned me completely off long ago (e.g. lied during French Open match when playing Serena). She has 'game', but when you compare her accomplishments against the Williams sisters (who have many singles titles, PLUS 7 Doubles titles and Olympic Gold medals), Henin falls short.

people who think wimbledon its better than RG are nuts and here is three real facts that show that

@ RG is of the for major to win the most difficult just see the games style in the others surfaces and clay , in clay you dont really need to be super powerful and have muscle , you need to be intelligent , have variety of shots and the most important of all you need to be consistent!!!! the most difficult thing in tennis

@ the most talented players in tennis history have won plenty of times here or have made plenty of finals see( lendl,borg,evert, las martinas,ferderer, nadal,HENIN,seles, graf , agassi etc,)

@ the french open its the most difficult slam to defend, i dont said , the numbers said that, only a few players did it . and guess wich is the " easiest" one : yeah WIMBLEDON and guess why:
because with and powerful serve and groundstrokes and a good net game can win it and , theres has been many players who even dont have net game and won it (sharapova, novotona,davenport , hewwit,etc

@

Tamowcoh-- Of course for the men, at least, RG has BY FAR the highest number of winners who never won any of the other three slams, or even got to the finals thereof. And let's not forget some pretty big names who never won RG, e.g. Connors, McEnroe, and Sampras.

i see you dont get the point of course because you really dont read well why:

because i said the most TALENTED players have won in RG and not the most winners(sampras) maybe i forget mac but as you can see
you statemnet is so wrong becausse the all rg Champs of the open era just tree women didnt reach or win any other major apart of RG
see this:
iva majoli and miskina , and if you wanted mary pierce who actually reach e more major finals(RG 05 and usOPEN 05)
and in mens only 3 mens did the same thing ;
andrez gomes, carlos moya and tomas muster
so that BY FAR I THINK ITS A LIE SO ,,,,......

Serena is the definatley the best of her generation. Followed by Venus/Henin. But now that Henin has quit, Venus will surpass her.

and congrats V!

a dont think serena its better than justine and thikn venus its a better player than serena but unfortunally vennus does care to beat her youngest sis because shes more sentimental and serena doesnt care she just want it badly every slam there play each other and this wimbi 08 show that venus now learn the leassons and just outplayed serena even she alwasy said that she made too many errors and bla bla bla she actually did least error than v , so defenility she needs too accepted the lost and keep working in her movement and fitness and thats why v always gona be my fave

GO V

according to tamowcoh, power, great groundstrokes and great net game, are not the qualities that you want as a tennis pro! of course its more impressive to win wimbledom over the french, even nadal has dreamed of winning at the all england club more than the french. venus is the more talented player of the two sisters, serena was in her head. tennis is as much a mental sport as any other for sure

"you statemnet is so wrong becausse the all rg Champs of the open era just tree women didnt reach or win any other major apart of RGsee this:
iva majoli and miskina , and if you wanted mary pierce who actually reach e more major finals(RG 05 and usOPEN 05) "

Um, Tamowcoh, I said, "At least for the men." But for the women in the open era you can add Ruzici, Jausovec, and Barker.

You also say, "and in mens only 3 mens did the same thing ;
andrez gomes, carlos moya and tomas muster
so that BY FAR I THINK ITS A LIE SO ,,,,......"

In addition to Gomes, Moya, and Muster, there is Gaudio, Costa, Kuerten, Bruguer, Noah, and Panatta. Ferrero, Chang, and Gimeno all reached finals of another slam, but never won.

For Wimbledon, in comparison, only Krajicek and Ivanisevic never reached the finals of another slam. Only these two plus Stich and Cash never won another slam. That would be 12 RG winners who never won another slam and 4 Wimbledon winners.

You might try a bit of research before calling someone a liar :)

tamowcoh is a stupid cow. She doesn't know what she's talking about. All these women (Venus, Serena & Henin have at least reached the French Open.) What's she on about? Plain stupid.

" (Take that, Elena Dementieva!)"
was that necessary, since Elena said that she was misinterpreted and that a language barrier was to blame for her statement?

Congratulations Venus, you are truly the Queen of grass.

" (Take that, Elena Dementieva!)"
was that necessary, since Elena said that she was misinterpreted and that a language barrier was to blame for her statement?

Very necessary. She speaks fluent English.

Its hard for me to separate the Williams sister. Granted they both have their own on court success, its hard to focus on one and not the other. Especially given the fact that the person Serena beat to get to her Slam (4 majors in a row) is her sister. So its hard for me to acknowledge one players success without mentioning the other and it makes me wonder if when history is told will they separate the sisters or will they be acknowledge as individuals. Serena for doing what only a hand full of Tennis players have done by winning four majors in a row and Venus for being one of the best Grass court players winning 5 Wimbledon and out of 7 finals (or more in the future)and for her efforts in fighting for equal prize money at Wimbledon. For me I think the Williams sister are the best of their Generation together and Justine is a close #2.

the impact that the williams sisters had on tennis is much greater than that of henin. we are still basically in the williams era of women's tennis.

venus definitely deserved this title. i felt sorry for serena, though. it was obvious how disappointed she was. i know people are criticizing her for not smiling her way through the awarding ceremony and the press con, but to me, it just shows her competitive spirit and how much she wanted to win yesterday. im all for an all-williams US Open final!:D

It doesn't matter who won, it never would have. Serena, Venus, Sharapova, Ivanovic, they're all the same - utterly predictable and with all the variety of a Canadian (in)convenience store. That's no criticism of the Williams sisters, far from it. In their basic and boring fashion they simply provide 'business as usual' for the WTA tour - a business built on doing the one thing over and over again until every fan who isn't a fanatic is turned away from the game. It's death by disinterest and it's coming to a court near you.

lets be REAL!!! five times wimbledon champion is Fantastic. How many players struggle to win One title. Venus has FIVE, I say FIVE, congratulation Venus

you need xanax.

I'm on the Zoloft to keep me from killin ya'll...

I enjoyed watching Henin and Hingis play as compared to Serena and Venus. Henin and Hingis used more tactics and its always good to see a smaller person win. Having said that, in their primes, the sisters can beat henin ANY day. they are so powerful i am glad they took their 'time out' in tennis, or else watching 2 sisters play finals of so many slams aint that exiting.

Also, any pro in tennis have their fair share of injury. you cannot factor in injury time-out or fashion designing or modeling time-out when you decide on who is the greatest. Seles was stabbed and out for sooooo long, so should she get points for that in the Greatness factor?

If you are talking about who has the best will to win, its Henin any day. I think she is one of the toughest mentally of all time.
2004 FO, Clijsters thumped a volley deep into the corner as she stood at break point down and the line judge called the shot good. But Henin signaled that the ball was out and the umpire, Sally De Jenken, agreed with her. Clijsters lost the game and match. You can call that another instance of Henin's bad gamesmanship. But you can't deny only the Henin have a will strong enough to make the umpire do a bad overrule for her.

Serena is going 2 win the US Open!
Serena is going to end the year as no.1.
That girl is very very mad at the moment.
She'll want 2 prove that she is the player 2 beat.

PS. Aren't Richard's predictions freakily scary?
He predicted Venus 2 win last year, and people thought he was crazy. We all know how that went........
After the tournament last year, he said that he believed Venus could win Wimby at least 3 or 4 more times.
2 or 3 more Wimby trophies 4 Venus, and he'll be right again......
and at this stage am not bettin against Richard.

Freaky!!!

Why don't you try and kill me first Jon-boy??? If you ever have the misfortune to meet me face to face, you won't need any medication to hold you back. Now return to your sofa, and go back to suck'n down your pills you freak.

Sorry Mr. Perrotta and fellow bloggers- you won't get anything like that from me again.

Venus Williams is a classy, elegant women and player. Though she didn't really play anybody till she faced her sister, but that wasn't her fault. Venus clearly has plenty of game left and isn't going anywhere for a while. Venus can still go on one of those inconsistant, error prone matches here and there, especially when a steady opponent can force her into long rallies. (see Dominika Cibulkova) On grass where a player can end points and games quick- she is a force to be reckoned with as any there are in the game. At this time now, I think there are only 4 other women at best that can hang with her on most fast surfaces. But whatever- she is the Queen of Grass. Congradulations to her.

Chiconinja & Just horsen-

Throwing my 2 cents in from way up there. I think Justine is the better player, while Serrena is the most dominant. Head to head- more often than not- it's the more dominant that comes out on top. I think we saw that almost 20 years ago when Steffi Graff and Gabriella Sabatini would battle each other. Gabiella was the more complete player, but Frauline forhand would overpower her 75% of the time.

With Justine and Serena, I think the line that separates is much norrower than with Steffi and Gabs, the victorius having the better day/season, and the very next match could easily go the other way. Had she played yesterday, Justine would not have beaten Venus. Against Serrena, who knows. All of that is just conjecture, but I don't think we've seen the last of Justine. For what it's worth.

Wow!!!

M-life just called Gabriella Sabatini (Major Titles - 1, Major Finals - 3, Singles Titles - 27) a more complete player than Steffi Graf (Major Titles - 22, Major Finals - 31, Singles Titles - 107).

Are you serious?

I hate bring up this stupditiy again because should all be about Venus Williams day at Wimbledon (before they both won the doubles)
Once again, anybody saying that Henin is more mentally tougher than either Venus or Serena is truly ridiculous and is blinded by her 5'5 frame, which as I have said constant times is not as detrimental as some people think, especially in the women's game.

Venus has had several more greater comebacks for Henin, and so has Serena Williams. The only memorable comeback Henin ever had was aganist Capriati in the 2004 US Open, a player who realistically was never near the status of a legendary player.

"Pound for pound she was the best of her era." Billy Jean King on the Queen. Go Justine, world#1 still the end.

should read until the end.

Congratulations to Venus on her fifth Wimbledon title. The match was excellent and very high quality. In regards to Demmy, she has said the same thing before at Indian Wells in 03, so Tom was right. BTW Tom, this was a great blog, I really loved it. M-life, I agree about Justine, I don't think we have seen the last of her, even she has said that she's not sure she won't come back. You never know, and I think we would see some great matches between Justine and the Williamses. Justine was one of the few players who can handle the power and serve of the Williamses.

Venus & Serena have the AAA game form on the board & its been a pleasure to watch them from the desert of Western Australia. There's too many airhead comments here & u should leave it all to the professionals.... reporters & interviewers. Stats? so i was looking at Justine (Who)s Wimbledon record. Yor all kiddin rite?? No singles or doubles, rite? & then there's Roger, Pete, Andre, Boris, Bjorn & the much revered Rod without a doubles win.??!! & you have the gall to glam up Justine (Who)!! The game today was a cracker. The Williams have a 5/2 singles & 3 doubles championships. The OETC should make a public apology on behalf of their sponsored crass post game interviewers who kept pushing the offensive "collusion point" with both the Williams after their semis. The same question should of been asked of the 'powder puff' Murray Bros & other connected players... yawn. I have daughters & granddaughters & every time we play any game it's always "world series". Go listen to McEnroe on Venus... " i can't serve that fast... her second is often better than my first... i could'nt cover the base line like her... jump like her... etc" & thats special from SuperMac who won 3 singles & 4 doubles at Wimbledon... rejoice, enjoy & chill.

samantha,

I think Justine is already thinking about coming back in my opinion. Slightly, I think she is.

When all is said and done, there will be no doubt who is the best of this era. I hate the tell you all William haters,but you gonna be disappointed.

first CRISTOPER:

YOU REALLY NEED TOO READ WHAT YOU WRITTE see:
you said:
RG has BY FAR the highest number of winners who never won any of the other three slams, or "even got to the finals thereof".
and then you change your idea:
In addition to Gomes, Moya, and Muster, there is Gaudio, Costa, Kuerten, Bruguer, Noah, and Panatta. Ferrero, Chang, and Gimeno "all reached finals of another slam, but never won".

as you can see i made my statmentin what you said first and
kuerten won 3 times at RG moya actually reach his first major final at the aussie open in 1997 and almost of the french open champions were NO. 1 and yes youre rihgt about youre saying but
you dont get my point anyway

and to letsgo :
what can i say , i person who doesnt know reall tenis

SNOWBONER :
ACTUALLY what i think and too many people think
is does federer or sampras died to ever have won the french , or maria sharapova or v dont want badly ,or martina hingis so
i just dont think wimbledon its better than the french no way
and
congrats v and i agree with the guy or goril that said that v its better than and serena is her head

The Williams sisters played great tennis this fortnight. I hope they stay injury-free and keep up the lovely tennis the rest of the year. Go, Ladies!

“Serena thinks everything is supposed to go her way, that’s the bottom line,” said her mother, Oracene Price, who sat in the players’ guest box for both matches. “She thinks that’s the way it’s supposed to go in life. But this is life.

“She’s going to have to learn how to suck things up,” Price added. “Say, ‘OK, I’m not going to win everything. I just got to be, this is going to make me a better person, this will build character for myself and I have to learn how to lose.”’

Great stuff from Oracene Price saying what it truly is.

Venus still looks like a giant PRAYING MANTIS when playing LOL

I think Serena is always going to be better than Venus and I think Serena let Venus win it thats the bottom line

GO SERENA

Well it looks like all the networks in the future will be praying for a Venus/Serena final again. This year's finals had the highest ratings since 05. Oh and I'm sure the men's ratings are insane. Wimbledon really got lucky this year. They could not have asked for better finals.

Oh and why do people assume that had Henin not retired early, she would have won Wimbledon? People seem to think had she beaten bartoli last year, she would have won. Are people forgetting that other woman named Venus Williams, who besides this year's final was playing lights out at that stage? I highly doubt even Henin would have beaten her. As for this year, you really think she would have beaten either sister? Really? Let's not forget last year she beat them when they weren't playing as well as this year.

I for one don't assume Henin would have won this year. But with Sharapova, Ivanovic both out early, her draw would have opened up in a way no one could have predicted going in. Since this is the only major to elude her, Henin probably regrets not entering.

Early sports retirements rarely stick (e.g. Jordan, Davneport, Ryne Sandberg...) I predict Henin will be back.

Finally, all props to Venus. I agree with most of what Perrota said about Venus' game compared to Serena's, but I'll add one more thing. At their best, Venus is more fun to watch: more athletic, always running. Serena can dominate, but it isn't as entertaining.

Justin Henin has had a great, great career. But a 5th Wimbledon firmly places Venus ahead of her. When you think of tennis' greatest champions you think Navratilova, Graff, Sampras, Federer, Evert, mainly you think grass. Why? Partly because it's Wimbledon, partly because its grass. Grass is the only natural surface. Fittingly, it allows for the most complete representation of the combination of raw athletism and tennis ability. That's why Wimbledon is undoubtedly the most difficult major to win. Does that count for anything?

The Venus vs. Serena match was great. And I also think it deserves an "A" grade. But, I have to agree with the other poster who said that Venus is more entertaining to watch. Serena's body-type is just not as visually appealing in an athletic sense as thin, tall, limbs-everywhere Venus.

DOMINIC
its obius that you dont know about reall tennis and not agree with you that wimbledonits the hardest major to win , the hardest one its RG with no doubt just look the greatest chapms actually had really problems to win at the french, except evert and graf

navratilova with her cappacity and talented just has a mere or 2
sampras just made a poorly semi and never reach and none final
federer maybe has bad luck cuz nadal, but if he want to be GOAT he needs to win just one time , he got the guns but no the edge

Serena, I am tired of your bad attitude when you lose especially to Venus. Suck it up girlfriend and stop being a brat! Venus & Serena are the best when they commit to the game & to the sport. Part-time tennis will not make the cut anymore. Others have caught up to them and surpassed them. now they have to set a new bar. it's tough to set a new bar when ur approaching 30! If it will be done then it can be done by the sisters. Henin was burned out & she wanted to live a regular life plus she knew she had to keep crashing with the sisters and Shara. 2 much 2 keep moving..I am not a Henin fan but I learned 2 respect her game & her committment 2 the game pre retirement. She is a mighty Lion in the sport. So hats off to them all! But this is Venus' moment. Wimbledon is hers and Serena will win the US OPEN!

This is Venus' moment. Please? I don't think the comparisons between her and Henin and Serena are pathetic attempts to downplay the performance of Venus. There is no comparison as we're talking about Wimbledon. And while I admire Henin, she has retired. Period. The two sisters are still around, and of course, with all logic that they will add more to their respectable collection of trophies. We cannot argue with 'what ifs'' because that will be mere speculation. Venus gave her best and proved herself to be the BEST among all these talented athletes, Serena included. And given her grace and elegance-- and according to Bill Clinton, "she moves like a gazelle,--" she might still end up to be Number 1.

I don't know about anyone else out there but todays match Nadal V Federer was the best men's match that I have ever seen. It was beyond nail biting and intense! My heart broke for Roger but I was ok w/Nadal's win. He earned every point to the end. It's time for Roger to get more aggressive and intense when he plays Nadal. Grunting is not your style Roger but you have to do something to break up his concentration! Grunt, scream, yell do whatever man...you have to come back!

MA: What will be Venus's ranking after the win? Serena?

ren:
the ranking wil be like this
1.ivanovic
2.jj
3.sharapova
4.kuznetsova.
5.serena
6.dementieva
7.vee
the others doesnt matter
a and the new member of the elite.
10. aggie radwanska

Thanks Tamowcoh! So Venus, will even drop in the rankings? Is this because her performance in Wimbledon is the same as last year's?

yeah actuaally when you won a tournament and then you come the next year and you win it again you just defend the points that you earned the last year , i mean every single point that a player earn has a 52 weeks of credit , then expires of you rankin points

This is so typical of Venus & Serena fans bashing others to elevate their idols.

Ok- I'm a Henin fan, but she retired. And what does this have to do with this Wimbledon? Justine's still a incredible player. Venus didn't even play anyone in the top 50 to be in a final. Grass is her best surface no one can take that away from her.

Justine is more versatile and talented than the Sisters, but she's only one person, and can't double up on totals of grand slams. Also had to work harder, faced life w/out the support of her mother on tour. Imagine if there was no Oracene for Venus or Serena on tour.

Each champion is different. I dont' see why talking trash on Justine is suppose to be interesting here. Venus owns Wimbledon. But she hasn't won Roland Garros either.

Can't win everything. Let's enjoy the tennis while some of these players are still on tour!

How anyone can say Henin is better than either Williams is beyond me.

Maybe its because she has more slams than Serena, wait, nope.

Oh, it must be her winning record against Venus, but that can't be it either.

Justine quit because she was falling hard and fast.

Congrats to Venus and Serena and I hope we see this many more times.

Henin can't be the best without winning Wimbledon. Serena is the BEST because she has won ALL the SLAMS. Henin has the BEST game because of her variety. Venus is the BEST grass court winner.

First and foremost Congratulations to Vennus!

Second, since the debate has arisen as to Venus or Justine for 2nd place right behind Serena remember this (and yes I know I am late joining the discussion).

- Venus is 7-2 against Justine
- Venus has the longest match winning streak of 35 wins (2000) since the retirement of Graf.
- Venus has now won Wimbledon (the most prestigeous of all GS)5x and been in the final 7x
- Venus has also won Olympic Gold in singles and doubles
- Venus is 2-0 against Justine at Wimbledon and 4-0 against Justine in finals.
- Venus has tied Justine with 7 Grand Slams and the chance to get more
- Venus has been the ambassador for women's tennis and the instrumental figure in getting the last two Grand Slams (Wimbledon and French) to adopt equal pay

As Venus said Wimbledon is the tournament to win. When people look at Martina Navratilova, no one talks about the fact that she never won the French because it is doesn't carry the same weight. everyone focuses on her 9 Wimbledon titles.

At the end of the day Venus is now chasing her sister as the best plyer of her generation. And if she can win the USO they will be on almost equal footing. The edge will continue to go to Serena for her Serena Slam unless Venus either a) wins AO and the FO or b) wins more Slams the Serena does by the time they retire.

WHY EVERY BODY THINK THAT wimbledon its the better of all
god come on thats to blabla, but anyway.

agree with the points of LOSTINTO but personally i think venus will pas serena in slam just look at her:

@ shes right now the best mover of the tour(jj its injury)
@shes more talented that serena. ivanovic,maria, and the rest
@she finally overcame little sis and all the pressure and mental edge that serena have over her
@shes super confident rihgt now kuz the wimbledon double
@and the most important i guess she is hungrieer than ever

so VEE will take us open over sharapova

Venus' chances at Roland Garros are diminshing! If she doesnt win it with in the next two years, I am not seeing a game,set, championship for Venus at Roalnd Garros!!
But she played wonderfully not dropping a set but the field lost some notable names (Sharapova and Ivanovic in the first week) even though Venus has twiced mauled Sharapova at Wimbledon! Although I would have liked to see Venus and Ivanovic go at like two lionesses, but Venus' sister was the most stout opponent but didnt play with enough enthusiasm consistently. It seemed as if she thought Venus was just going to concede that match for some ludocris reason but Serena can be very unstable emotionally in some matches and thats very strange.
Sharapova's serve is going south again and Jankovic is always injured and Ivanovic now has to bear the pressure as a Grand Slam cahmpion. Although the Williams' are getting older they can still snatch a few more majors each year until they retire, IF AND ONLY IF THEY TRULY WANT TO. And as far as Justine who has said that she would come back, really needs to get her life together for real and find out if she really wants to be out there cause she is sounding a little immature. Brillaint game but the mind is a cloud of obscurity to me. If she returns, it wont be easy at all and she has no ranking as she strangely asked for it to be taken off. Bad decision if she is talking about coming back. But the dominant forces in the womens game are: Sharapova, the Serbians, the Williams sisters and several Russians so we will see what they bring in coming years

Its funny that people keep mentioning the diminished field, but at the end of the day only Ana and Maria were past champions. No one speaks about Svetlana, because it was expected that she would choke at some point and she did. Ana is an unproven commodity at the moment even though she has won her first GS. Maria has the ability when everything is clicking but at present the William Sisters are in her head as she has lost the majority of those encounters over the last 24 months.

What this tournament has shown is that Venus is having the rebirth that she started to have last year before whatever undisclosed arose at the USO during her semi-final loss to Justine. This year she has set up her schedule to peak at this time to include Beijing and the USO.

On a side note. I do feel like Venus will (as long as she remains healthy) actually continue to a) contest more Slam finals and b) finally surpass Serena in Slam victories. The reason for this was displayed in the final. Venus was standing 2 feet in from the baseline to receive Serena's serves. She was not afraid of them. She knew she might get aced (9x) but she new she needed to cut the angle as much as possible. Also what is probably the most important reason, was mentioned in Peter Bodo's analysis, is that Serena since her knee surgery has not had the same mobility that she had when she won her Serena Slam. That was evident in the match as she seemed to be one step slower than before. If anyone has noticed she seems to have worked on excuting winners from anywhere on the court, however, if she is forced to hit that extra shot that is where the miss has occurred. Which explains why Henin had been able to defeat her at the Slams last year.

It is definitely an interesting time in women's tennis. Beijing and the summer hardcourt season will let us know if we are in for a revival of the Williams Sisters or if this was just a temporary interlude.

I HOPE I AM WRONG BUT IF RUMORS ARE TRUE, THERE IS A SPECIFIC REASON WHY HENIN ABRUPTLY RETIRED. I COULD BE WRONG SO I WANT SAY THE RUMOR, BUT IF IT'S TRUE LIKE ALL THINGS IT WILL EVENTUALLY COME OUT. THE TRUTH BE TOLD IN THEIR PRIME. THE WILLIAMS SISTERS IN MY OPINION ARE THE BEST BY FAR. I ALWAYS FELT IF VENUS COULD GET OVER THAT PROTECTION THAT SHE HAD FOR HER LITTLE SISTER SERAN, VENUS WOULD BEAT SERENA. I MUST ADMIT I ADMIRE THE COMPETITIVE EDGE TO WIN THAT SERENA HAS, BUT I'M GLAD THIS TIME VENUS WON. I DO LIKE BOTH SISTERS VERY MUCH. I LIKE HENIN, BUT I'M NOT FOND OF HEFR PERSONALITY.

Justin Henin is suspect in two ways: she couldn't beat the Williams sisters when they were at their best [she beat both Serena and Venus when both had injuries!]and Serena humiliated and exposed her at the Miami Open [6-0 was the last game!]. Second, Henin retired because she was going to be caught in a steroid controversy. Mark my word: Henin was using something and her fellow Belgium, Kim, knew it and said something about it.
As for the greatest tennis player in this period, I vote for Venus though seriously if she doesn't win Australian Open and the French Open, Serena is the greatest. Henin did win Wimbledon!!
Venus won it five times!!

i love you both keep your heads up and keep on winning lady.......................tee a true fan

at the end the best and # 1 players are venus and serene those other girls don't play so well

Some people won't stab a relative in the back, and others will. Venus had every right to win Wimbledon. She did not beat her sister, she beat an opponent that happens to be her sister.

Justin has never won WIMBLEDON.

how did this discussion turn into being about Henin??? She's gone. It's over, finito! Let's enjoy Venus and Serena while we have them. Yes, they have extracurricular activities. Yes, they don't play every week. Yes, they don't always say the right things and people may not like their dad.... but they are here. They've endured lawsuits, family loss, racism, and professional criticism. They have lived through it all and remain ambassadors for the sport of tennis and female athletes all over the world. Congratulations Serena Williams and Venus Williams. You make me proud to be a complete nutty fan of you 2!!

It is not about Justine, but when you compare Venus and Serena, you still have to include Justine in the mix because she was the only female player to keep up with them in the end. At the end of the day her sudden departure leaves many unanswered questions. And although I was not a fan of hers (I fell asleep during her rogers Cup Final win against Jelena last year and got sunburned on top of that) she was a great foil for the Sisters. She brought the best out of them. For that I wish she was still around to face Venus and Serena Williams. But alas that won't happen and it will be up to the Sisters to push each other back to the top.

Serena is the the player of this generation. Period

The only reason that Justine went on a roll for a while is because Serena and Venus was injured after Wimbledon 2003 and she cheated Serena out of that French Open that year by lying about holding up her hand. Had she had to deal with S &V during that time she would have never had as many Slams as she does now.

james, I'm Belgian, and have alot of respect for what Venus and Serena have done in tennis. But it's sad to see so much hatred about Justine on this website.

Had it occurred to you that her retirement opened up the draw for them by not having to get a match with her?

If this is the type of respect Justine has in America, I can see why she doesn't want to return ever to tennis.

Congratulations to Venus, she played an excellent match and beat a worthy opponent who happened to be her sister. I do long for the day when one sisters win will be applauded and respected for just what it is. I do not want to wait for the sisters to retire before recognizing what wonderful athletes they are or how beautifully Venus Williams conducts herself. How many 17 year olds would have kept walking after being deliberatly bumped by Spirlea at the uso? How many would have gone on to win that match? Venus did. Remember Serena's match against Kim in Ca. when she was booed the whole match. She won then too. These two women are champions in every way and should be respected while still playing. Enjoy them while u can, love em or not we will miss them when they leave.

I like the Williams sisters. Especially Venus. Her game is much nicer to watch, with its elagance and fluidity. It more easily masks the power she generates with that racquet than Serena's game. Serena appears in all respects to be punishing the ball. Less artistry and Finess. Much like Nadal versus Federer. Though I like them both (Nadal & Federer), I have to go with Federer considering the degree of difficulty and required precision involved in playing at today's high level of today with that style. No wonder it is a dying art. Which brings me to my favorite Woman player of this generation. Justine Henin. Personality etc. aside I like her game.
Considering her size in today's women's game she truely is a pure talent. Off the ground she's great and slique. Psychologically she's a monster. She's the woman I like to watch. That backhand. The best in the business. Men and Women.

Alex man, come on...There is no way on this earth that Serena would let anyone win...Venus won because she was the better player, period. She will undoubtedly be considered the best grass court player of her time. Justine played a good game, or should I say a smart game, but most of the time the Williams sisters beat themselves with their unforced errors. Justine is not better than Venus and she *@#% sure is not better than Serena. Serena's power alone overshadows Justine. I wondered why she retired, I almost wish she had stayed because she is a smart player. I am glad that Lindsey came back. It is always good when the best play the best. I think in the end Venus will have made the greatest contribution to the game during her career, and will ultimately have the title as best of her generation, especially if she wins a 6th Wimbledon and most especially if she threepeats...I love Venus and I respect the way she carries herself. She is a gracious young woman and she is and always will be number one in my book.

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