Concrete Elbow by Steve Tignor - Eastbourne: Florida in England
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Eastbourne: Florida in England 06/16/2008 - 7:15 PM

2008_06_14_eastbourne_blog Freelance writer Wendy M. Grossman will be blogging from the Eastbourne International during the early part of this week. Here's her first dispatch:

Pre-Wimbledon, the men have Queen's, the women have Eastbourne. Set on the south coast in East Sussex, Eastbourne (population 90,000) is kind of Florida in the sense that it's theoretically warmer than the rest of England and people retire here.

This tournament, probably the oldest on the WTA calendar, has shrunk: in 1989 almost every top player entered the 56-draw; this year, the original top two seeds, Ana Ivanovic and Maria Sharapova, both pulled out leaving Svetlana Kuznetsova in charge of a 28-draw in which, weirdly, the only two former Wimbledon champions, Lindsay Davenport and Amelie Mauresmo, are both unseeded.

The year Mauresmo won Wimbledon she lost here in the first round. Last year, she was the Eastbourne finalist – only to lose to Nicole Vaidisova in the Wimbledon fourth round. So although she says she wants the matches and wins to improve her confidence, the omens are uncertain. Today, she fought her way through the kind of match that has happened to her too often lately: cruised the first set, eased off so her opponent, talented up-and-comer Alizé Cornet, took the second, and finally righted herself late in the third set to win 6-1,4-6,7-5.

Afterwards, she said she loved being back on the grass, playing the "old natural game of grass". That was the key to the first set and to ultimately winning the match; in between, she said, she retreated to the baseline, playing right into Cornet's hands. Like so many of the young players, Cornet may not know much about the traditional grass court game, but knows what to do against baseliners.

At Queen's last week, all the players talked about adapting to grass. Changing their movement was the key, but Nadal, Djokovic, and Roddick talked about their serves, their sliced backhands, their need to come to net more. The women, by contrast, Svetlana Kuznetsova observed today, seem to want to play the same game on all surfaces, and the coaches around them seem to give this same limited advice. To be sure, no one's going to make major changes for a surface they only play on three weeks a year. But they could, she said, "adapt some things". For example, she says, she finds she needs to abandon her favored topspin forehand to hit flat and long from the baseline. But she finds the change refreshing and motivating. "You have to do something else sometimes." Every year, she says, she gets more experience and enjoys grass more.

Agniezka Radwanska, the first Polish player ever to reach the top 30, could almost be a textbook example of what Kuznetsova is talking about. Although she says Wimbledon is "my favorite Grand Slam" and notes that she did well there the three times she played it in the juniors, she says there's nothing specific she does differently on grass and she doesn't really change her game for it. Her big goal now: to make the top ten.

This being early in the tournament, there are British players, Katie O'Brien and Mel South. O'Brien couldn't do much against Sam Stosur's serve (but then, who can?) in their first round match on Court 1. But she showed the effects of a very notable change in British tennis: she looked fit. Last year, the British women were easy to spot because they all looked like they'd just gotten out of school. This year, the LTA's new fitness program is beginning to pay off. Even though O'Brien lost, she's one of several women inside the top 200, and Britain has a woman, Anne Keothavong, inside the top 100 for the first time since Sam Smith in 1999.

Australia's Sam Stosur is just happy to be back playing in full health. Shortly after Wimbledon last year, she got sick. She didn't know what she had, but she was, she says, "extremely ill". From the sounds of it, what she went through over the following four months was pretty much like the experience of patients on the TV show House. On top of the extreme fatigue she was already experiencing, she got viral meningitis which came with terrible headaches. Finally, in September she got a diagnosis – Lyme disease – and could start getting treatment. In total, she was out for nine months. She finally started training again with 15-minute walks in February, and made her tournament comeback at Rome in May. Her special ranking got her into Eastbourne, and Wimbledon has awarded her a wild card. Against O'Brien, her serve occasionally misfired but she never looked like losing. Mauresmo, next, will be a tougher test. Stosur is also in the doubles with Lisa Raymond, hoping to resume the successful partnership that took them to the #1 doubles ranking two years ago.

In the last match of the day, Victoria Azarenka requested her coach on court at 1-4 down to Aravane Rezai in the first set. This is the first year on-court coaching has been allowed at Eastbourne, and even professional coaches could be heard grumbling about it. Not sure how much it helped: she held serve the next game, but trailing 2-4,30-40 with Rezai serving she called for the trainer to work on her right hand – what looked like a blister between her third and fourth fingers. At 2-5 down, she requested the trainer again, this time to strap her left knee. Limping slightly, she went out to serve to save the set, lost her serve, and retired.


 
38
Comments
 

Posted by gray 06/16/2008 at 08:01 PM

first

Posted by Chris 06/16/2008 at 08:24 PM

In fact, the Bank of the West Classic at Stanford, CA, is the oldest women's only event. Its website states that it has been running for 38 years.

Posted by Master Ace 06/16/2008 at 08:41 PM

It is indeed incredible that most of the WTA top players skip the grass court tournaments due to injury,rest,or etc... If Svetlana Kuznetsova wins here, she may ride the momentum to the title at Wimbledon. If she pulls that off w/out a retirement by her opponent in the final, that would be her first big win since beating Maria Sharapova at Key Biscayne in 2006.

Posted by Hai 06/16/2008 at 09:33 PM

The state of women's game is a joke. Sorry. I'm just calling it as I seet (watch) it.

Posted by Master Ace 06/16/2008 at 09:35 PM

Hai,
What is your reasoning why the WTA is a joke? Heard a lot of opinions on this subject already.

Posted by Misha 06/17/2008 at 12:37 AM

I just cannot understand why women's tennis is held at such low esteem. I agree that the matches in men's tennis - especially the ones between the big three- are excellent. But how good was men's tennis after Sampras quit and Federer did not become a force? That was the time when women's tennis was in much better shape with Venus and Serena winning and Maria, Davenport and others providing the competition.
More recently, what about the sheer shot-making ability shown by Henin and Mauresomo? The level of tennis displayed by Henin is/was as good as that of Roger. The point is one cannot make such statements like "men's tennis is superior to women's tennis".
What irks me the most is that nowhere in the GOAT debate do the names of Graf and Navratilova surface! Why should that competition be between Laver, Borg, Emerson and Roger alone? I think what Graf accomplished was much superior to what Borg or Laver did and with all respects Roger ever would. Even if it pure talent one is talking about, Graf was no less talented that the names i mentioned. Even the likes of Bodo, Wertheim and Tignor are not immune to this biased sort of thinking.

Master Ace, like to know your thoughts on this especially.

Posted by Cynical Count 06/17/2008 at 01:30 AM

Svetlana seems more interested in making friends and being nice than in winning!

Posted by abbey 06/17/2008 at 02:02 AM

i think what's sad about women's tennis now is the apparent lack of respect the top players show for their tour per se, where it's beginning to be just about the grand slams. i see this as especially true for the older champions like the williams sisters and sharapova. they don't even seem to care much about the rankings. now, they don't bother to show up to the run-up events thinking and believing that they can use the early round matches of the grand slams to get that match practice they need. you would think the early round exits of the williams and sharapova at the french open would be an eye opener, but i guess not. even ivanovic and jankovic, who show hunger for the no. 1 spot have decided to skip the pre-wimby tournaments citing injury. they are just not threatened enough by the lower-ranked players to fear that they'd be taken out early if they go into a grand slam not match tough. i guess surface difference too doesn't really post much changes to the women's game (as noted in the post) to warrant the preparation needed on grass that on the men's side seem to require.

Posted by Markic 06/17/2008 at 03:16 AM

I agree with Abbey: if the top women can't be arsed to show some commitment to their tour and becoming the best ever, sticking around long enough to win 10+ slams, then why should anybody else take an interest, esepcially when Roger is making history?

Posted by Cynical Count 06/17/2008 at 03:53 AM

Markic: Roger making history? You mean by not winning the FO?...lol

Posted by Wayne Hawkins 06/17/2008 at 04:48 AM

I agree with Abbey too. I am disappointed that very few women on tour make an effort to learn how to play grass court tennis. Many just play the way they do on clay. I find that approach really frustrating.

I just hope Mauresmo gets her act together before Wimbledon and Venus turns up ready to play. These two really know how to play on this surface. When they are at their best they are a joy to watch.

I am really hoping that Marina Erakovic goes well at Wimbledon. Marina has been steadily moving up the rankings and is now in the mid fifties. She grew up playing on grass in New Zealand, just as I did. She's not afraid to go to net and with a good draw could do some damage. Go Marina!

Posted by roGER 06/17/2008 at 04:56 AM

Thanks for the article, Wendy.

You made an excellent point about the British girls looking fit!

For years I was amazed to see so many professional players (especially the women and not just the Brits) neglected the one area of their game that requires no special skills or equipment.

It's so obvious than in a match between two equally skilled competitors, the odds have to be in favour of the fitter player.

Posted by uawek 06/17/2008 at 05:07 AM

In fact Agnieszka Radwanska is the second polish player to reach the Top 30. The first one was Magdalena Grzybowska, who reached #30 in 1998. http://www.sonyericssonwtatour.com/2/players/playerprofiles/Playerbio.asp?PlayerID=70322

Posted by Clare 06/17/2008 at 05:09 AM

"What irks me the most is that nowhere in the GOAT debate do the names of Graf and Navratilova surface! Why should that competition be between Laver, Borg, Emerson and Roger alone? I think what Graf accomplished was much superior to what Borg or Laver did and with all respects Roger ever would. Even if it pure talent one is talking about, Graf was no less talented that the names i mentioned"

SPOT ON!! It frustrates me so much to see the likes of Navratilova and Graf left out of the GOAT debate simply because they are women. If you are allowed to transcend generations when talking about this, then surely you should also transcend sexes.

Posted by rg.nadal 06/17/2008 at 06:32 AM

Well said Clare. I too feel Graf and Navratilova should be right there in the mix for GOAT title contention.

Posted by Pierre 06/17/2008 at 07:36 AM

Very nice songs on your website, Wendy.

Posted by Master Ace 06/17/2008 at 08:06 AM

"What irks me the most is that nowhere in the GOAT debate do the names of Graf and Navratilova surface! Why should that competition be between Laver, Borg, Emerson and Roger alone? I think what Graf accomplished was much superior to what Borg or Laver did and with all respects Roger ever would. Even if it pure talent one is talking about, Graf was no less talented that the names i mentioned."

Misha,
Well said but with the state of the WTA at the moment and the excitement of the ATP, there is a tendency not to mention Steffi and Martina N. Also, do not for Margaret Court, who has the most Slams, and Chris Evert, best person ever to play on clay. Chris has the longest winning streak on clay ever at 125 and after losing to Tracy Austin in Rome via a deciding tiebreak, she won 72 more clay matches in a row. Before her stabbing, Monica Seles was at that time to Steffi as Rafael Nadal to Roger Federer now.

WTA Slams leaders:
Margaret Court 24 - 11 AO, 5 FO, 3 W, 5 USO
Steffi Graf 22 - 4 AO, 6 FO, 7 W, 5 USO
Martina Navratilova 18 - 3 AO, 2 FO, 9 W, 4 USO
Chris Evert 16 - 2 AO, 7 FO, 3 W, 4 USO
Billie Jean King 12 - AO, FO, 6 W, 4 USO
Monica Seles 9 - 4 AO, 3 FO, 2 USO

In conclusion, GOAT is mentioned more in the ATP 'cuz Pete Sampras won 14 Slams and Roger is 2 away from tying that mark but I have a feeling that if Roger gets to 15 by the end of 2009 and Roger has said that he wants to play until 2012. Court, Graf, and Navratilova names are going to be the focal point of any conversation even though Rafael and Novak will be at his heels.

Posted by Story of Os 06/17/2008 at 08:52 AM

Should GOAT be the one whom we bet our lifes on to win a tennis match against an unknown opponent on an unknown surface or should it be decided simply based on the total number of slams / grand slams won? When counting slams, should there be a discount factor for Serena's and Graf's numbers. Everyone has its own definition of GOAT, we all want our favourite to be the one and our own GOAT definition may change when a new favourite comes along. Are we wasting time here to rank the hall of famers?

Posted by jojo 06/17/2008 at 08:59 AM

Does the sexism of pro-feminists never cease? Navratilova and Graf are not in the conversation for GOAT tennis players ......not because they are women, but because they were nowhere near as good players of tennis as Federer, Sampras, Laver, Gonzales etc Simple. Case closed. If any of these wonderful women athletes had played any of the best men, they would have lost 99 times out of a hundred, or somewhere there about.
At the same time, there is a point to be made concerning the fact that that we don't discuss the question, "Who is the greatest WOMAN tennis player of all timer?" A legitimate point. My vote would go to Steffi for career resus, and a tie between Monica, Steffi and Serena for peak results......It's hard to leave Martina out of the equation, but I think she dominated an easier game...she may be the greatest grasscourt player of all time. and Chris was the greates clay player........Margaret Court wom 11 of her GS's in Australia.....when no one went there....I unfortunately, did not see her play.......thought the record is clear, she dominated her time.......

Posted by jojo 06/17/2008 at 09:19 AM

Upon reading my last post, i think I overstated something.......Steffi is the one woman who could have played with the men...maybe.....she was just as fast as any man, she was extrememtly focused, her forehand was a s good as any man's, and her serve would not have been the liability that most women's serves would be when facing a man.....it's a shame she never competed witht he men in an exhibition or whatever......I've talked with a local pro who thinks that the modern women can compete with the modern men.......I think that he might be right in this sense.....a top woman could take a match occasionally from a top thouseand man.....but I still think the men's game is wuite a bit superior.....

Posted by Clare 06/17/2008 at 09:25 AM

It's nothing to do with feminism jojo, (I'm certainly no feminist) but more to do with respect for various players. It's just about recognising all of the great players and their achievements from the past when we talk about the best players to have graced our game, not just the males. Of course there are very dubious points to crossing genders when debating this, but crossing generations is just as shaky in my opinion, as players are using different racquets, playing different opponents and played in contrasting political climates. Then there is the question of when they retired. The whole conversation of GOAT is therefore already incredibly debatable, so why not shove in a few big female names who have achieved incredible things such as winning close to or in excess of 20 slams.

Posted by Vincent 06/17/2008 at 11:51 AM

Well then, let's also include the badminton players in the debate ! And the soccer players, too ! Hell we crossed the gender line, why not cross the "different sports" line... My god, when will this dumbness ever cease...

Posted by Chris 06/17/2008 at 12:10 PM

Clare. "The whole conversation of GOAT is therefore already incredibly debatable, so why not shove in a few big female names who have achieved incredible things such as winning close to or in excess of 20 slams." Doesn't make any sense. The point is as jojo mentioned in previous posts. The greatest female players wouldn't have a chance against their male counter-parts. The reason is a purely physical one. Men are quicker, fitter and stronger and therefore their tennis potential is greater.
Of course, there are women so physically gifted that almost bridge that gap. Namely Graf, Navratilova and the Wiliams sisters. However, put them on the same court as a Nadal on clay and a Federer on grass or hard courts and they would have absolutely no chance.
Eventhough some of the female GOAT's records might be more impressive they are not in the same league of tennis ability of the male GOATs. That is the reason when commentators talk about the GOAT they invariably talk about the men.

Posted by piyush sharma 06/17/2008 at 12:11 PM

Roger Federer might win wimbledon but is likely to lose to joker at the US open and all talk of his being the GOAT has started vanishing !! His large number of grand slams have been won against less distinguished opposition as compared to Sampras & Borg ; and now that Djokovic has arrived, it appears time for federer to move down a notch lower in the rankings by the end of the year ; Maybe, he can still win more than a couple of grand slams but GOAT !! Hey, how is that ? Roger probably cannot regularly beat Djokovic on hard courts ! And the media will conveniently forget about his having being a GOAT !!
Nevertheless, Federer is a great champion as Sampras and Borg and MCnroe and Connors have been but declaring him the GOAT was a bit too unfair to many of the great champions of the past ; who played with wooden racquets and did not have the comfortable express travel facilities to australia ;
Djokovic himself is no multi-slam champion, yet ; and Nadal is a single surface multi-slam champion;
And Federer has had tremendous variety in his game and has given lots of joy to his millions of fans ; His inside out and cross court forehands have the mark of an artistic genius ; his serve is as sharp as ever ; Excellent volleying, slice, drop shots, et al ; he is one of the great champions in tennis history ; but GOAT !! What is that ?
Yes , it will appear unfair to federer that he will stop winning grand slams frequently with the arrival of Djokovic ; and the talk of GOAT is getting drowned with the emergence of a new generation of players ;

Posted by solid35player 06/17/2008 at 12:31 PM

Misha, agreed that Graf should be at the top of any discussion of the greatest, based both on accomplishments and on sheer talent and athletic ability. She may be the greatest athlete to ever play. And yes, Henin and Mauresomo are (were) great shot makers with beautiful games.

As to the lack of respect for the women's game, sorry. I love tennis and I love watching either gender, but way too many of the WTA players, even the top players, seem to lack mental toughness. It seems far more likely that female players will flake out during tough matches. Yes, this happens on the men's tour, but seemingly not as often. Beyond that, the finals of the majors and other big events are often just not very good matches. The just-past FO final was pretty entertaining; neither player collapsed and both played high-quality tennis, but that has sadly been the exception. Maybe the changing landscape up near the top of the WTA (retirements and aging players) will shake things up and lead to better matches.

Posted by dbhyuih 06/17/2008 at 01:02 PM

last! HA

Posted by piyush sharma 06/17/2008 at 01:28 PM

Borg has won six french opens ; nadal only four so far ; it will take a while to start considering nadal as one of the greatest clay court players ; let us wait for a couple of more titles ;

Djokovic is good but we do not know if he is going to be a multi slam champion ; but he appears capable of beating fedex on hard courts;

Fedex appears the best bet on wimbledon because of his unfailing serve ; nadal can also win ; in any case, fedex is on his last legs as no 1 ; Fedex has 4000 points to defend till dec ; joker and nadal only 2000;

Posted by Clare 06/17/2008 at 01:53 PM

Vincent - now that would just be silly!

Chris - I didn't really express myself very well.

I understand the point about men Vs women and men having the greater ability. I know that is why the female players don't enter the frame in the standard debate we always have, although I maintain that I think they deserve more credit for what they achieved in the general conversations which rank player achievements in the history of the sport.

Everybody sees the GOAT debate differently. Personally, I don't think a GOAT can ever really exist (apart from the actual animal of course), as I think you can only ever have a GOATE (Greatest of a Tennis Era). There are so many variables when you compare players of different generations (racquets, politics, length of careers, opponents they faced, surfaces of slams, merits of their individual achievements etc etc) that it makes the whole thing flimsy and very hypothetical. I think it is impossible to properly compare ability of players from different generations.

There are many different ways of coming up with a GOAT, and as i don't think that there is really a fair and objective way of doing it for the males, that is perhaps why I would go out of the box and add female players into my personal GOAT debate and look at it in a slightly different way.

I would put all of the big names in, both male and female and I would compare how players dominated their own specific era, the individual shots that they produced, how they affected the way the game was played (not policially like BJK, but in terms of actual play), the records they achieved and the calibre of opponents they achieved them against etc.

I'm not saying my way is the right way, but it's just a way of looking at it, as I fail to see another accurate way of coming up with a difinitive GOAT. As I said before, I understand why the females don't get included in the "proper" discussion, but if you play around with your criteria, then they can still find a way into an interesting debate.


Posted by gabriela valentina 06/17/2008 at 02:17 PM

@ clare
If you are allowed to transcend generations when talking about this, then surely you should also transcend sexes.

I'm weighing in with my two cents worth- late- but I hope still on time to say that clare has a good point here!

Posted by gabriela valentina 06/17/2008 at 02:19 PM

@ clare
It's nothing to do with feminism jojo, (I'm certainly no feminist) but more to do with respect for various players. It's just about recognising all of the great players and their achievements from the past when we talk about the best players to have graced our game, not just the males....

ANOTHER point to clare. At this rate she'll take the set !

Posted by Sandra 06/17/2008 at 02:22 PM

Why should the women need to adapt their game as much as the men in order to play on grass? It seems to me the men have to adapt more between grass/clay due to the fact that the men tend to play a more specialized game on each surface, rather than a more all-court game on each surface. Therefore, it stands to reason that the men would need to adapt more going from clay to grass or vice versa. Also, given that the men are taller, it also stands to reason that they would have to adapt more to getting down lower to the ball than the women do - most of the male players are over 6' 1" whereas most of the women are not - the women who are taller also have to adapt somewhat more to getting down low than the regular sized women. I don't think see that any of this has to do with laziness on the women's part or industry on the men's part - it's just a reality based on the fact that men are taller and tend to play a more specialized game on clay.

Posted by gabriela valentina 06/17/2008 at 02:23 PM

@ vincent

Well then, let's also include the badminton players in the debate ! And the soccer players, too ! Hell we crossed the gender line, why not cross the "different sports" line...
My god, when will this dumbness ever cease...

Why, how very perspicacious of you VINCENT to see the "dumbness" in your own post!!
apples and oranges,Vincent,apples and oranges.....

Posted by gabriela valentina 06/17/2008 at 02:27 PM

What do you think of the coaches being allowed to give advice during a match? For? Against? it's allowed in team sports and individual sports(in the intervals) so what is so special about tennis. is it the "tradition" or will it really affect the way the game is played and make it something else'

Posted by 06/17/2008 at 02:55 PM

“i think what's sad about women's tennis now is the apparent lack of respect the top players show for their tour per se, where it's beginning to be just about the grand slams. i see this as especially true for the older champions like the williams sisters and sharapova”


The Williams’ sisters didn’t play the game the way a lot of the other tennis players did. They started relatively late on the tour. They never played week in and week out. They were never about tennis all the time. If anything, they have stayed true to who they are.

Posted by solid35player 06/17/2008 at 02:59 PM

Gabriela_v, call me hidebound, but I'm opposed to on-court coaching in tennis. Yes, it's tradition (not necessarily a bad thing), but it's much more too. While tennis is a very physical sport and one that requires great skill and ability, it's the mental aspect that often separates the good from the great. A lot of players (myself among them) can win the warm-up, but it's how you put it all together during the match that results in wins or losses. Why not let those players who can sort it all out have their advantage--on-court coaching potentially penalizes those players because bringing a coach into the live mix of a match changes the dynamic between two players. And singles is about one player vs. another. The very best players usually combine the skill with the mental aspects. Occasionally a less gifted player will overachieve based upon mental acuity and toughness. Rarely does a player reach the very top based just upon physical skill alone. Think Fed, who was always gifted, but didn't reach the top until he put it all together. Or maybe BJK, who was not necessarily the best athlete, but who knew how to compete and how to win. On the flip side, you've got Safin, a man with incredible skill who has underachieved because he cannot put it together on a regular basis.

Maybe one exception is Graf. My view is that she was basically so much better an athlete that she could win on that alone. I don't think she ever reached her full potential because she never needed to. Serena may be in similar territory. Understand that this is not a knock against Graf, who is one of my favorites and is on my GOAT list. I think she would have improved to whatever level was needed because she was one heck of a competitor. It's a great shame that one sick fan robbed tennis of her rivalry with Seles, who had gained the upper hand. Seles would have pushed Graf to continue to improve.

My 2¢.

Posted by Rich 06/17/2008 at 05:34 PM

OMG Wendy - I was on the floor laughing hysterically at some of your observations, especially the ones on British ballers. I'm not sure you meant them to be funny, but in my own twisted mind they were.

I even had to write a post on it for my tennis blog Down the Line!:

http://www.downthelinetennis.com/2008/06/is-it-wimbledon-or-wendy-thats-making.html

In any case, thanks for the laughs!

Posted by Story of Os 06/17/2008 at 06:45 PM

Solid 35 player, nicely done on switching the stab incident around to work for Graf. I doubt it very much that Graf would be able to reach a higher level with Seles on her side. She would be in the same uphill position as when Fed faces Nadal on clay. I hope you are right though, maybe Nadal will help Fed put it all together, mentally.

Posted by sally 06/17/2008 at 09:12 PM

piyush sharma-how many times do you write the same post, i have read your post on at least 5 different threads. we get it, you think roger is a bum. let it go already.

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